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John Mearsheimer

@john-mearsheimer · 22 positions · 0 changes of mind

Professor of political science at the University of Chicago and the author of The Tragedy of Great Power Politics, the founding statement of offensive realism.

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  1. I believe that power is the currency of international relations, and by that I mean that states are deeply interested in the balance of power and they're interested in maximizing how much power they control.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:01:39 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 1st of 22 in this recording

  2. The two key building blocks of power are population size and wealth. You want to have a lot of people and you want to be really wealthy.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:02:39 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 2nd of 22 in this recording

  3. So it's very important to understand that I'm not arguing that states are inherently aggressive. My point is that as long as states are in anarchy, they have no choice but to behave in an aggressive fashion.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:06:43 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 3rd of 22 in this recording

  4. A realist like me would say that it doesn't matter whether a state is a democracy or not, all states behave the same way because the structure of the system, getting back to our earlier discussion about international anarchy, the structure of the system leaves those states no choice, whether they're democracies or autocracies.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:15:36 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 4th of 22 in this recording

  5. The point is that economic interdependence at its root has prosperity as the core variable. In the realest story, the core variable is survival, and survival always trumps prosperity.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:20:19 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 5th of 22 in this recording

  6. I'm not a defensive realist, I'm an offensive realist. And my argument is that states look for opportunities to gain more power, and every time they see, or almost every time they see an opportunity to gain more power, and they think the likelihood of success is high and the cost will not be great, they'll jump at that opportunity.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:23:17 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 6th of 22 in this recording

  7. And I believe that there is a good chance you would've had World War II in the absence of Hitler. I believe that Germany was very powerful, it was deeply worried about the balance of power in Europe, and it had strong incentives to behave aggressively in the late 1930s, early 1940s.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:25:04 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 7th of 22 in this recording

    Europe

  8. There's no evidence he was interested in conquering all of Ukraine. There was no evidence beforehand that he was interested in conquering any of Ukraine. And there's no way that an army that had 190,000 troops, at the most, could have conquered all of Ukraine, it's just impossible.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:43:36 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 8th of 22 in this recording

    Russia

  9. And of course, what they were negotiating about was NATO expansion into Ukraine, which was the principal cause of the war. People in the West don't want to hear that argument because if it is true, which it is, then the West is principally responsible for this bloodbath that's now taking place.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:45:22 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 9th of 22 in this recording

    war

  10. Well, what's good for the goose is good for the gander. And if we don't like great powers coming into our neighborhood, it's hardly surprising that the Russians did not want NATO on their doorstep.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 0:47:45 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 10th of 22 in this recording

    RussiaAmericawar

  11. I don't think there's any real prospect of a meaningful peace agreement. I think it's almost impossible. I think the best you can hope for at this point is, at some point the shooting stops, you have a ceasefire, and then you have a frozen conflict. And that frozen conflict will not be highly stable.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:03:04 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 11th of 22 in this recording

  12. My second point is if he doesn't remain in power and he's replaced, I would bet a lot of money that his replacement will be more hawkish and more hard line than Putin is.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:17:58 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 12th of 22 in this recording

    Russia

  13. So that's why I argued in '93 that if Ukraine kept its nuclear weapons that made war down the road much less likely. And I believe I was correct.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:24:47 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 13th of 22 in this recording

  14. The way you use nuclear weapons in that world is you use them for manipulation of risk purposes, demonstration effect. You put both sides out on the slippery slope.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:27:22 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 14th of 22 in this recording

  15. I think the main driving force is that the Palestinians feel oppressed as they should, and that this was a resistance move. They were resisting the Israeli occupation.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:39:45 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 15th of 22 in this recording

  16. The Palestinians want a state of their own. They don't want to live under occupation. And there's no military solution for Israel here. There has to be a political solution.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:50:48 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 16th of 22 in this recording

  17. That's why I've sort of taken to saying, and I hope I'm wrong here, that on the two-state solution, that boat has sailed. It's no longer possible.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:55:17 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 17th of 22 in this recording

  18. So our argument is that the lobby is not doing anything that's illegal, or illicit, or immoral, or unethical. It's just a good old-fashioned American interest group. And it just happens to be extremely powerful.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 1:58:15 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 18th of 22 in this recording

    America

  19. I think what the Israelis are doing in Gaza represents a massacre. I would use that term given the number of civilians that they've killed and the fact that they've been indiscriminate in terms of how they've been bombing Gaza. But I would not use the word genocide.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 2:21:01 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 19th of 22 in this recording

  20. A lot of people think that to make deterrence work, you have to be able to beat the Chinese and therefore, you need a much bigger military. And I don't think over time that's possible. I think it's probably not even possible now to beat the Chinese in a war over Taiwan or in a war in the South China Sea.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 2:46:51 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 20th of 22 in this recording

    ChinaAmerica

  21. The Chinese are my kind of people. They're realists, right? They speak my language. It's the United States that is not very realist. American leaders have a very powerful liberal bent and tend not to see the world in realist terms.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 2:56:29 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 21st of 22 in this recording

    ChinaAmerica

  22. All the evidence is that Hispanics are integrating into the American mainstream more quickly and more effectively than the European immigrant groups that came starting around 1835.
    spoken · official transcript hear it at 3:13:59 · all korrents from this recording

    John Mearsheimer: Israel-Palestine, Russia-Ukraine, China, NATO, and WW3 | Lex Fridman Podcast #401youtube.com 22nd of 22 in this recording

    immigrationEuropeAmerica